Only 400 lions left...

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I have no words to describe this...
I consider how all these poachers will live and get money when all tigers, rhinos, elephants, lions etc. are extinct?! Idiots!   

sorry to say this but, all these poachers should be killed mercilessly. their lives are not equal to the valuable lives of these precious precious creatures.

Ohhhh no !!!!!     

But Sauro, it is not only the poachers. It is pollution and loss of habitat !

We humans are TOO MANY, no matter what they say ! We spread like bacteria and all animals except flies and rats   

      

Terrible, so upsetting. It's just not fair, how can people be so evil?!

I once read of a program in Africa in which captured poachers were converted into game wardens and trackers for safari trips. This way, they could put their knowledge of wildlife to good use, and earn some money doing it.

The sad thing is if you think about it this is one of the first animals you learn of as a child.Horses, cows, dogs, lions and elephants, tigers... sadly the last three are all going extinct quickly.   

Actually, elephants are better off than most people think. In fact, there are so many in areas that culling is necessary. I am not totally on board with the culling idea though. I think that if they want to remove elephants, they should allow hunters to harvest one elephant, then they can keep what ever they want, and give the rest to natives.

this may sound extreme but i have to say it. the poachers MUST be culled, not converted. that way, there'd be no more poachers who would follow their footstep due to fear.
*these kind of humans have no place in this planet. they are as terrible as those people who have committed atrocities to other human beings*

IMO People have to stop breeding... There are enough humans already on this planet....
For the lions, I think it is to late. Only 250 lions of a breeding age are left. Cubs die fast, if not well protected or fed. If hunters get their hands on the remaining 250, it is done

by the way, poachers arent the only ones that should be destroyed/dealt with with extreme measures. also the big time international syndicates who support/fund the poaching and the actual consumers of illegal animal byproducts like fur, skin, tusks, horns, bones/fangs, etc. their level of evil is immeasurable, up there among drug syndicates and human traffickers.
*admins/mods: sorry if the subject matter isnt for our younger readers, but im sure they are intelligent enough to comprehend these adult matters.*

cattlecollector wrote:

I once read of a program in Africa in which captured poachers were converted into game wardens and trackers for safari trips. This way, they could put their knowledge of wildlife to good use, and earn some money doing it.

That is a brilliant idea !
Education is the only way, - and fewer people, as Night says !!!

Of COURSE we can NOT have a death sentence on local people !
Especially not on ignorant people doing what their ancestors have done for thousands and thousands of years of years, Sauro   
It is - when it comes to that - the "white man" who ruined everything in Africa !!!!!!!!!!

SUSANNE wrote:

cattlecollector wrote:

I once read of a program in Africa in which captured poachers were converted into game wardens and trackers for safari trips. This way, they could put their knowledge of wildlife to good use, and earn some money doing it.

That is a brilliant idea !
Education is the only way, - and fewer people, as Night says !!!

Of COURSE we can NOT have a death sentence on local people !
Especially not  on ignorant people doing what their ancestors have done for thousands and thousands of years of years, Sauro   
It is - when it comes to that - the "white man" who ruined everything in Africa !!!!!!!!!!

Honestly, I think that we are the reason there are poachers. Before we came to Africa, natives hunted to survive. We labele them killers and poachers, just because they lack the knowledge that some animals are not quite as plentiful as others. Also, there would be no poachers at all, other than meat hunters, if we were not providing a market for those horns, feet, and hides of poached animals. To the natives, they may just see this as another way to make some money and put food on the table for thier family's.

That is so true, CC !!   

I agree, the only reason for poaching like this in this scale is for luxury items like ivory and hides. At the same time though there may be an issue with people who go to Africa to get that "trophy" or Big 5kill in their own record books. But of course certain meats are also considered delicacies. So its totally any human who likes those things that is to blame as well as poachers.   

Saarlooswolfhound wrote:

I agree, the only reason for poaching like this in this scale is for luxury items like ivory and hides. At the same time though there may be an issue with people who go to Africa to get that "trophy" or Big 5kill in their own record books. But of course certain meats are also considered delicacies. So its totally any human who likes those things that is to blame as well as poachers.   

I don't think hunters can be blamed, as long as it is done responsibly.

this crisis isnt only limited to lions and/or Africa (think of siberian tigers, sumatran rhinos, snow leopards, chamois, sea turtles, sun bears, etc etc etc). this is a worldwide problem that needs to be taken care of ASAP before it's too late (i think it may even be too late). these socalled "impoverished" natives are funded/supplied with high-powered firearms and other killing machines by the international criminal wildlife trade to kill both the animals they are targeting and the very people who are trying to stop them so they arent exactly innocent or ignorant of what they are doing.

cattlecollector wrote:

Saarlooswolfhound wrote:

I agree, the only reason for poaching like this in this scale is for luxury items like ivory and hides. At the same time though there may be an issue with people who go to Africa to get that "trophy" or Big 5kill in their own record books. But of course certain meats are also considered delicacies. So its totally any human who likes those things that is to blame as well as poachers.   

I don't think hunters can be blamed, as long as it is done responsibly.

The problem with the "professional" (couldn't find a better word for it sorry) hunting is that it is not always done responsibly. Not everyone knows or cares about trying to preserve the population and some don't understand ecology and trying to boost numbers and genes etc. with diversity of individuals. Some people go to Africa, find a guide that will take them to their quarry, and that's it. And at the same time, there are some species who can handle heavy hunting and their numbers still rise because of adaptability to environments (coyotes and deer in the US being prime examples) and there are those who can't adapt as quickly and therefore struggle to populate (namely elephants in this particular instance because of their long pregnancy term and high mortality rate for calves nowadays).
I don't mean to start a fight. It's just in situations like these, there isn't anyone free of blame. Everyone has a hand in this somehow.   All I hope for is that they can somehow be preserved and that the situation can be handled intelligently.  

Professional hunting is very a strictly monitored, with very few licenses given for endangered game. Also, there really are not many places where you can hunt truly wild animals. Many outfitters operate on huge areas of land that can be enormous, but is surrounded by fence. The animals here are allowed to act just as they do in the wild. Many never even come into contact with humans. Hunts for rare species are also controlled by prices. A hunt for a tusk less elephant cow past her prime will cost upwards of $7,500, and a bull will often go higher than $10,000. Not many can afford this, therefore, not many hunters are impacting the elephant herd. I don't see anything irresponsible about it. I honestly do not want to cause an argument, so please don't get angry with me. This is just my opinion, not fact. I am sure that there are a few irresponsible hunters out there, some even around where I live. We just need to keep on educating so the younger generation will know right from wrong and understand how important conserving or wildlife is.

I would never get angry with you CC, I would always respect your opinion.   Anyways, you also taught me something. I didn't know that there were eclosed areas with mostly wild animals in them etc. However, what I meant about the above was that there is no way of knowing just how many there are out there who run hunting businesses and do it honestly, regardless of regulations (people always find ways out of things like that). Like I said, many are oblivious to the fact that there has to be a healthy regular population out there for it to sustain itself etc. and some may not care about anything but a paycheck. I'm not condemning all hunters, of course not and far from it, but I would find it hard to believe that there aren't dishonest ones out there. And the reason I keep bringing up elephants (not that they are more important than any other species) is that they and rhinos are hunted heavily by poachers and its hard for animals with an already long term pregnancy period and difficult reproduction cycle to keep a healthy population when their parents are killed, ivory taken, and the baby is left by itself (hence the afore mentioned mortality rate of calves for both species). Lets not forget that the Western Black Rhino was just announced as officially extinct, for obvious reasons. And I didn't mean that hunters were affecting every species with their activities, I was just saying that with a combination of respectable hunters and non-respectable hunters (poachers and the previously mentioned dishonest ones) impact population along with natural factors.

Anyways, like I said, its not just one single thing that affects the populations of a species whether its lions, rhinos, elephants, zebras, or more "domestic" (to you and me) species, its a combination of things that causes havoc. All we can try to do is like you said, teach responsibility, educate those who need it, and try to be careful about how we regulate and try to preserve our planets resources.   

Lastly, please don't read this as an attack on you. I'm viewing this as a simple discussion, so please feel free to disagree with me etc. I'm curious about the subject and would be interested to learn more from you if you have any information. This is just my simple (limited) opinion and I'm curious to hear yours as well.  

I am not angry at all. I also just remembered something I saw on TV the other day. They offer "green" rhino hunts. In this hunt, the hunter uses a tranquilizer gun shooting tranquilizer darts. The hunter gets the opportunity to "shoot" the rhino, then he can have his picture taken with it when the rhino is unconscious. Then, a researcher can take all measurements about the animal as we'll to find out its health, age, and weight. It works out all around. The hunter gets a cool hunt and picture. The researcher gets information than can further help protect the rhinos, and the rhino gets away without a scratch.

That's really cool actually. See, there are positive solutions for things like this. I would much rather tranquilize the big guy than anything else, that way the hunter benefits as well as science for it. Thanks for sharing.  For me, rhinos are kind of scary though. I would worry that he was going to wake up any minute while I posing with him.   

Such horrible news to hear....

absolutely no human should ever kill another lion, leopard, cheetah, rhino, hippo, elephant or any other African animal again for sport or trophies!! this practice is extremely wrong, cruel, destructive and evil