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 A manufacturers view on scaling

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Egbert

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PostSubject: A manufacturers view on scaling   Thu Dec 06, 2012 8:53 pm

Firstly before i lead into the question of scales and why modern manufacturers find it difficult, i thought it was time that i introduced myself pirat
Obviously some of you know me as Egbert but others also know that i am James from Mojo, so hello to everyone Very Happy

I have been following STS for well over a year now and have to say i am a huge fan. Sometimes it's difficult not to get caught up in a debate and discuss the issues, but given my position and from a professional point of view I have avoided such situations thus far.
However now that everyone knows who i am, I feel more relaxed in opening a debate or even discussing issues raised, obviously provided they relate to Mojo only. I will not discuss other companies or their products and i trust you will both understand and respect my decision on this matter.

OK my first topic..................here goes!
I have read so many times on STS, debates in respect of scaling and why today’s manufacturers don’t seem to follow the scale set by companies such as Brittains.
Well the answer put simply is modern safety standards.
To build a range to scale firstly you have to make your smallest pieces to such a scale that when the larger animals are made they will not be way too large for any retailer to comfortably fit on their shelves nor of such a price that would adversely affect sales. Obviously companies such as Brittains did not have the modern day restrictions and so were able to make very small animals and therefore the larger animals sat comfortably alongside and gave a true feeling of perspective.
Today’s regulations mean that animals such as rabbits have to be a minimum size in order to avoid possible choking hazards, hence the average rabbit from most manufacturers is probably around 1:6-1:8 scale. Obviously to make a larger animal in a scale to match this would be impractical.
Another problem with the smaller models is that if they are made too small the average retailer will not stock them, seeing them as a potential shrinkage problem or perhaps not representing value for money. At the other end of the scale the same can be said of the bigger models, if we make them too big, then again there will be a pricing issue, the product will be seen as too expensive and no matter the collector market and its importance, without good retail support it is very difficult for any manufacturer to survive.
In truth scale is only one part of the problem, and whilst from a collector’s point of view having everything in scale would be Eutopia. From a manufacturers point of view we have to consider that size costs and whilst the collectors market is very important it probably represents no more that 10% of overall sales. In order for us to create some special animals that are different and not made purely for commercial purposes then we must cater first and foremost to the other 90% market share who want a very nice animal but at a reasonable price.

Many thanks for listening James albino (we need a squirrel emoticon!)
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PostSubject: Re: A manufacturers view on scaling   Thu Dec 06, 2012 8:58 pm

Very very interesting. Many thanks for this informations sunny sunny sunny sunny sunny

And welcome cheers cheers

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PostSubject: Re: A manufacturers view on scaling   Thu Dec 06, 2012 9:00 pm

Now I can say:
Welcome James on forum! It is a huge honour to have you as a emember and friend here in STS. You are a part of our family and it is great to know that you enjoy with us! Very Happy
Thanks for clearing up everything around the scale subject. A very informative topic to all of us that never worked in a company. If I expected something like this it was surely from you. The company manager I know that work closer to collectors! Thanks! cheers

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PostSubject: Re: A manufacturers view on scaling   Thu Dec 06, 2012 9:14 pm

Thank you Roger and Andreas......its great to be here!

Also just in case anyone is wondering, just because i am a forum member doesn't mean that you can't discuss our animals honestly and openly.
If you don't like something then just say it, without an honest platform and unbiased critical review how can any company improve.

James rendeer
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PostSubject: Re: A manufacturers view on scaling   Thu Dec 06, 2012 9:23 pm

I would say that. But i worked a long time in a shop and so i know the amrket rules. But my wish, i think any of us know that, are more unusual species.

Now i worked with childrens they are go to school. And i know that elephants, lions ... are important for the market but i also know that childrens are very interested in animals, so i know where i work a lot of the kids have animal and dinosaur figurines. And so i could imagine that also unusual species will be good.
But Mojö do anything for my zoo- i know Very Happy Very Happy Very Happy Very Happy Very Happy

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PostSubject: Re: A manufacturers view on scaling   Thu Dec 06, 2012 9:37 pm

Egbert wrote:
Thank you Roger and Andreas......its great to be here!

Also just in case anyone is wondering, just because i am a forum member doesn't mean that you can't discuss our animals honestly and openly.
If you don't like something then just say it, without an honest platform and unbiased critical review how can any company improve.

James rendeer


Sad(o)): Sad(o)): Sad(o)): cheers sunny king santa
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PostSubject: Re: A manufacturers view on scaling   Thu Dec 06, 2012 9:55 pm

Hello, hello, - so the anonymous Egbert is really the generous James Connolly cheers

Great, and VERY interesting, to hear about the real life of a manufacturer.
And great to see that you are so interested in us collectors that you even are a member of our forum Very Happy




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PostSubject: Re: A manufacturers view on scaling   Thu Dec 06, 2012 10:29 pm

This is a surprise! Welcome here, even though I guess you have been around a while. Very Happy


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PostSubject: Re: A manufacturers view on scaling   Thu Dec 06, 2012 11:01 pm

Wow!!What a surprise and great to have you on board!!My big problem is that I have no stockist of Mojo in my area!!
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PostSubject: Re: A manufacturers view on scaling   Thu Dec 06, 2012 11:27 pm

It's so nice to be able to call you James now Very Happy

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PostSubject: Re: A manufacturers view on scaling   Fri Dec 07, 2012 12:37 am

Shocked Its you. Shocked Wow, thats kinda embarrassing that I never even suspected... shows how observant I am... Embarassed Well, WELCOME MR. CONNOLLY! That is very interesting what you shared about the scales, thanks for sharing.
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PostSubject: Re: A manufacturers view on scaling   Fri Dec 07, 2012 8:48 am

Shocked Shocked Shocked scratch scratch scratch

Roger... I need to know the truth... Are you the owner of Maia+Borges ? Laughing Laughing Laughing

James, I thought you were a zero posts member and I never suspected you were the famous Egbert. So welcome again on STS forum James Egbert Connolly cheers

And now I will suspect every members of this forum to be someone else. Wink And I will suspect the other admins and mods to keep their cards well hidden. I'm happy to understand that Susanne was also unaware of this Laughing I will have to take my pills against paranoïa Laughing

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PostSubject: Re: A manufacturers view on scaling   Fri Dec 07, 2012 9:49 am

A warm welcome Eg... James! I'm very happy you're also a member of the forum. I think we're the most lucky forum members in the world. That you're a member is like to have Santa living in home Laughing : he will bring you the presents you want or not, but you must be sure that he will listen to you Sad(o)): That's what happens with Mojo. Although you think collectors is only a 10% you're giving us the opportunity to express our desires into reality and many of them. thank you very again much James!

About scales: this is an old request of mine Embarassed . And expressed by a professional is entirely clear for me because in my work I am also very, very limited by regulations. It is a very expensive work to suit to them and be at once satisfied with your creation. It occurs to me to set different scales for different series, as you are doing now (I think) with prehistoric mammals; or work with different scales for different sizes, creating a progressive scale seriation eg 1:5, 1:16, 1 : 22 and 1:30

Kikimalou wrote:
And now I will suspect every members of this forum to be someone else. Wink And I will suspect the other admins and mods to keep their cards well hidden. I'm happy to understand that Susanne was also unaware of this Laughing I will have to take my pills against paranoïa Laughing

No paranoia Christophe... I must say... I am Ramona Pariente! Laughing Laughing Laughing

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PostSubject: Re: A manufacturers view on scaling   Fri Dec 07, 2012 10:00 am

Welcome James, it's indeed nice to call You officially James here also, haha. :) I'm not surprised that Egbert was not a pirate squirrel Laughing
Interesting info about scaling too. :) cheers

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PostSubject: Re: A manufacturers view on scaling   Fri Dec 07, 2012 10:04 am

Abu Rai wrote:
No paranoia Christophe... I must say... I am Ramona Pariente! Laughing Laughing Laughing

I already knew that geek monkey Laughing

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PostSubject: Re: A manufacturers view on scaling   Fri Dec 07, 2012 10:12 am

Kikimalou wrote:
Abu Rai wrote:
No paranoia Christophe... I must say... I am Ramona Pariente! Laughing Laughing Laughing

I already knew that geek monkey Laughing

Laughing Laughing

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PostSubject: Re: A manufacturers view on scaling   Fri Dec 07, 2012 11:25 am

I apologize Egbert to avoid discussing the scale point, the hidden identity scoop was The big revelation for me cheers .

I understand your point as a manufacturer and I agree it is more important than collector's points. You are playing the match and we are commenting, and love also, the sport Laughing .

Scales are important for me, not because I want to have everything in one scale but because I like to learn new things and, except in some zoos, we are not able to feel the real size of animals. I agree with Balti, it would be good to compare and watch animals at the same scale. A British child in the 1970's could see what is the size differences between an elephant and a leopard, just at looking at his toys. It is impossible now and I regret it even if I understand why it is impossible Wink

Scales are so important for me that I use to collect them all cheers Laughing. It's fun to discover your topic because I was thinking to open a new topic, a bit on the " Lilliput and Brobdingnag" style, about models in scale with each other whatever the brand. I just need now to make the first pics Sleep drunken

Nevertheless, I hope you will try to match the scale everytime it is possible, for example with your 1:30 prehistoric mammal serie. Cool I know it would be difficult for a baluchitherium Laughing Laughing Laughing

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PostSubject: Re: A manufacturers view on scaling   Fri Dec 07, 2012 11:50 am

Funny how for example many Breyer horses are in scale to other toy brand birds, cats or rabbits Laughing Seriously, they look very nicely next to each other. bounce

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PostSubject: Re: A manufacturers view on scaling   Fri Dec 07, 2012 3:30 pm

Well, hellloooooo James Very Happy

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PostSubject: Re: A manufacturers view on scaling   Fri Dec 07, 2012 4:20 pm

ana wrote:
Funny how for example many Breyer horses are in scale to other toy brand birds, cats or rabbits Laughing Seriously, they look very nicely next to each other. bounce
I agree Very Happy

It would be nice to have all the larger animals in scale with one another.

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PostSubject: Re: A manufacturers view on scaling   Fri Dec 07, 2012 5:29 pm

Thank you everyone for your very kind words, i feel most humble to have such a warm welcome from STS friends.

So Kiki.....................Now i have to call you Captian Kiki pirat Or maybe Long John Kiki lol!

For the scale issue, frankly i do want to try to match scales wherever possible and i will try to the future, hence my trial with 1:30 scale for the Prehistoric range.
Like many of you I feel there is such beauty in a range that has true perspective, it looks so natural.

In respect of Breyer scaling, firstly you have to remember that most if not all of the larger horses are in fact blow moulded (hollow inside) and this manufacturing process is much cheaper. Hence they can offer a relatively large figure for a reasonable price. However Blow moulding also has its limitations in terms of texture and fine details. So the figure has to be larger in order to gain some good details.

If we manufactured a horse to the same scale as the larger Breyer horses whilst retaining our current production process (solid injection moulded).
Then our price for a horse of this size would be 25-30 EUROS, if we start to talk about something like a Zebra or Giraffe with difficult painting then it could be even more.

It is a good comparison but if you chose Breyer production technique and scaling it would be a trade off, fine detail and texture or scale?

Not easy i'm afraid scratch study scratch
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PostSubject: Re: A manufacturers view on scaling   Fri Dec 07, 2012 5:34 pm

Egbert wrote:
Firstly before i lead into the question of scales and why modern manufacturers find it difficult, i thought it was time that i introduced myself pirat
Obviously some of you know me as Egbert but others also know that i am James from Mojo, so hello to everyone Very Happy

..........................

Many thanks for listening James albino (we need a squirrel emoticon!)

You are James Connolly from Mojo question question Shocked Shocked Shocked Welcome James! cheers cheers cheers Wink And BTW thanks for information! Sad(o)): Sad(o)): Sad(o)): Sad(o)): And again many thanks for your beautiful package! bounce bounce bounce bounce

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PostSubject: Re: A manufacturers view on scaling   Fri Dec 07, 2012 5:49 pm

What a great surprise Sad(o)): Sad(o)):
Hi james and welcome :) You are really one of us Sad(o)):

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PostSubject: Re: A manufacturers view on scaling   Fri Dec 07, 2012 7:43 pm

Egbert wrote:
Thank you everyone for your very kind words, i feel most humble to have such a warm welcome from STS friends.

So Kiki.....................Now i have to call you Captian Kiki pirat Or maybe Long John Kiki lol!

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PostSubject: Re: A manufacturers view on scaling   Fri Dec 07, 2012 7:52 pm

Egbert wrote:
For the scale issue, frankly i do want to try to match scales wherever possible and i will try to the future, hence my trial with 1:30 scale for the Prehistoric range.
Like many of you I feel there is such beauty in a range that has true perspective, it looks so natural.

Captain James Egbert Connoly, I'm sure you will cheers

Egbert wrote:
It is a good comparison but if you chose Breyer production technique and scaling it would be a trade off, fine detail and texture or scale?

Not easy i'm afraid scratch study scratch

About the trade off, fine detail and texture or scale? I'm 100% for the texture, detail... and unusual species bounce Laughing

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PostSubject: Re: A manufacturers view on scaling   Fri Dec 07, 2012 8:03 pm

Kikimalou wrote:
Egbert wrote:
For the scale issue, frankly i do want to try to match scales wherever possible and i will try to the future, hence my trial with 1:30 scale for the Prehistoric range.
Like many of you I feel there is such beauty in a range that has true perspective, it looks so natural.

Captain James Egbert Connoly, I'm sure you will cheers

Egbert wrote:
It is a good comparison but if you chose Breyer production technique and scaling it would be a trade off, fine detail and texture or scale?

Not easy i'm afraid scratch study scratch

About the trade off, fine detail and texture or scale? I'm 100% for the texture, detail... and unusual species bounce Laughing
cheers cheers cheers cheers

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PostSubject: Re: A manufacturers view on scaling   Fri Dec 07, 2012 8:23 pm

I love also figures in scale not because of dioramas but mainly because of the educational results of it. Anyway, I understand completely that Mojo and other brands doesn't follow it. You're explaining very well the reasons and we, collectors, are also responsible for it.
I know only some members that defend figures in scale and I know a lot of members that defend them not in scale.
When I find someone saying that CollectA zebra is to large when compared with Schleich zebra it makes me crazy. They are almost the same size only the sculpting is different what makes them with different proportions. Though, zebras in real, have a larger size variation than these 2 figures. It is also disturbing seeing some members, not only the young ones, commenting that Papo hippopotamus is too large. Too large compared with what? Actually it is small when compared with the average sizes of all brand ranges. Why? Because Schleich hippos are incredibly small and because Schleich is the most popular brand, their sizes are accepted as true representations of the sizes of the animals. Is it Schleich fault? No, as long as almost all brands follow the same strategy.But people works better with what is used and History has teached us that when people is used with what is wrong, people will defend it as a religion. Why insist that the Earth orbits around the Sun when everybody sees clearly that it is the Sun that moves in the sky? sunny
So, I don't want Mojo being a victim of the Schleichcentrism once the brand is already a reference in educational aspects, giving us, for example, species like the Iberian lynx and giant sable, adding some information and making efforts to help the Institutions envolved in their preservation. Very Happy
Also, Mojo is a brand that lives only from its animal range and I think the reintorduction of figures in scale is less dangerous to brands that has animal series in a secondary level of importance. Why people asks often Mojo? Because it is the brand that listens to us. :)
However, I'm also glad that you're introducing prehistoric mammals in 1:30 scale, contrary to Christophe I think it is not a huge problem to make a baluchitherium once in volume it is not much larger than a deinotherium. Worse is to make a smilodon apealing in 1:30 scale, something that would result smaller than the Iberian lynx, even worse trying to make some even smaller prehistoric mammals. It goes long! Laughing

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PostSubject: Re: A manufacturers view on scaling   Fri Dec 07, 2012 10:48 pm

Hello E

Finaly you give youre real name,,Mister master piece creator James

Welcome in our community,good to see you here
and cleared up some scale formality's

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PostSubject: Re: A manufacturers view on scaling   Sat Dec 08, 2012 7:15 am

Roger wrote:

However, I'm also glad that you're introducing prehistoric mammals in 1:30 scale, contrary to Christophe I think it is not a huge problem to make a baluchitherium once in volume it is not much larger than a deinotherium. Worse is to make a smilodon apealing in 1:30 scale, something that would result smaller than the Iberian lynx, even worse trying to make some even smaller prehistoric mammals. It goes long! Laughing

A baluchitherium would be a BIG model Roger, bigger than an average deinotherium, especially if Mojö would make it as bulky as his deinotherium. I must say I hope so, the "fitness style" indrico from COLLECTA is not really my cup of tea Laughing .
IMHO the problem is not only the size but also the prospects of sale. A baluchitherium is not a best seller as a Trex so I'm not sure a huge and expensive model would be a comfortable choice.
It would be great to know Egbert's point about this scratch

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PostSubject: Baltimore zoo   Sat Dec 08, 2012 9:36 am

James thanks so much for taking the time for your explanation. I have always wanted some "relative scale"(I never say scale, because as we have determined that would nearly impossible) newer toy lines like my Britians.

As I have mentioned before(Not sure if you saw my recent post) the popular Hasbro Star Wars line which has their individual figures(3 3/4" figures) selling for $5.99 to $8.99 and then two or three figure packs, larger vehicles/space ships and creatures for any where from $10.99 to $150.00. Even though it comes down to pricing, Hasbro has a lot of variety, and they offer the product and collectors/parents/kids buy it! So if you want to pay $150 for a larger item like the Millennium Falcon or an AT AT Walker you can or $25 for the Rancor you can! Don't think you would have to charge $150 dollars for a Deinotherium the size of a Safari WW Asian elephant, but $15-$20 wouldn't be unreasonable(I see how the the 2013 prehistoric mammals are in scale to each other).

Because I like to display my animals on the same shelf, I am really limited(Ex: I have my Papo tigers placed near my Safari WW Asian elephants(Different lines, but it works for me), although not perfect scale, but it looks way better than the Papo tigers next to the Papo Asian elephant) because I really hate the size differences.

Anyway, again, thanks for taking the time to explain, and perhaps think about how Hasbro pleases its fanbase by (Although not perfect scale), using some "relative scale" with their 3 3/4" figures as their focal point.
So if worried about safety regulations, make the big cats & great apes your "3 3/4" figures focal point" and make the antelopes, giraffes, zebras, hippos, rhinos, elephants off that scale (So if you did a savannah diorama all those would look descent together). And then for the smaller mammals (rabbits, weasels, otters etc.) go larger scale for child safety.
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PostSubject: Re: A manufacturers view on scaling   Sat Dec 08, 2012 10:08 am

First off, welcome James! It's great to have you here (as yourself).

The question of scaling is interesting. All other things being equal, I'd love to see animals sculpted in relative scale. But other things aren't equal, and it seems the costs of pushing too hard for relative scale are too high. James' comments help clarify these costs.

I always thought I appreciated the fact that I was collecting children's toys. But the significance of this fact didn't fully sink in until we had the discussion about the upcoming 2013 Mojo Sloth. When some members complained about the position of the Sloth in the crook of two tree trunks, it was pointed out (by Roger, I believe, who was communicating the point from Mojo's James) that the sculptor wouldn't be able to represent the gorgeous sloth claws safely unless they were wrapped around the tree trunks.

I was already delighted by the pose (I was one of the people arguing in favor of it), but the realization that the tree trunks were needed to make those amazing claws safe really impressed upon me the limitations under which toy manufacturers are working.

Safety is one issue. Sales is also, of necessity, an issue. We're lucky to have companies like Mojo bringing us diverse and fascinating figures (like that awesome Sloth!), but it seems clear that if Mojo's giraffes and elephants cost $25-$30, you'd have a lot of parents who might have purchased a Mojo figure buying a Schleich, or Safari, or Papo instead. I just don't see how Mojo could possibly make relative scale a serious aim and at the same time flourish.

So, although I'd love to see more animals at relative scale, I'd rather see companies flourishing.

And I can hardly wait for that Sloth. Very Happy

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PostSubject: Re: A manufacturers view on scaling   Sat Dec 08, 2012 10:17 am

Maybey when they make a baluchitherium,they can make it as a special production
smae they can do with the megatherium,,
like every year a special edition mammal Sad(o)):

wow now i have for 2 years olready a special edition Very Happy

with limited copies,,
ofcourse the collectors wil have first choice

Martien

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PostSubject: Re: A manufacturers view on scaling   Mon Dec 10, 2012 12:49 am

Kikimalou wrote:
Roger wrote:

However, I'm also glad that you're introducing prehistoric mammals in 1:30 scale, contrary to Christophe I think it is not a huge problem to make a baluchitherium once in volume it is not much larger than a deinotherium. Worse is to make a smilodon apealing in 1:30 scale, something that would result smaller than the Iberian lynx, even worse trying to make some even smaller prehistoric mammals. It goes long! Laughing

A baluchitherium would be a BIG model Roger, bigger than an average deinotherium, especially if Mojö would make it as bulky as his deinotherium. I must say I hope so, the "fitness style" indrico from COLLECTA is not really my cup of tea Laughing .
IMHO the problem is not only the size but also the prospects of sale. A baluchitherium is not a best seller as a Trex so I'm not sure a huge and expensive model would be a comfortable choice.
It would be great to know Egbert's point about this scratch


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I continue thinking that who makes a deinotherium in 1:30 scale don't have any technical problem to make a baluchitherium in the same scale. Sales is another question. Of course it doesn't sell as much as a T-rex but probably it sells as much as some sauropods. As baluchitherium is larger in many aspects and only a little heavier than a large deinotherium, I believe it is not as bulky as a deino. Anyway, I agree with you and I would love best a paraceratherium bulky like a rhino than the half giraffe/horse interepretation of CollectA. It was surely a very massive creature although it is also very tall and long.
I like best th pose of this diagram than the giraffe pose. Very Happy

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PostSubject: Re: A manufacturers view on scaling   Mon Dec 10, 2012 6:46 am

Roger wrote:
I continue thinking that who makes a deinotherium in 1:30 scale don't have any technical problem to make a baluchitherium in the same scale. Sales is another question. Of course it doesn't sell as much as a T-rex but probably it sells as much as some sauropods. As baluchitherium is larger in many aspects and only a little heavier than a large deinotherium, I believe it is not as bulky as a deino. Anyway, I agree with you and I would love best a paraceratherium bulky like a rhino than the half giraffe/horse interepretation of CollectA. It was surely a very massive creature although it is also very tall and long.
I like best th pose of this diagram than the giraffe pose. Very Happy

I don't say it is a technical problem, making a big sauropod is possible so there is no technical reason MOJÖ would be unable to make a Paraceratherium. I was talking about commercial reasons. This animal is believed to reach 4,5 or even 5,5 meters at shoulders. It means a 1:30 Indricotherium would be 15 or 18 cm at shoulder. For example, the 2012 COLLECTA giraffe is 18cm at the TOP of the head !

5,5m baluchitherium
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4,5m baluchitherium
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I have a 1:40 Indricotherium model and it is already a massive guy Wink

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PostSubject: Re: A manufacturers view on scaling   Mon Dec 10, 2012 3:52 pm

Kikimalou wrote:
Roger wrote:
I continue thinking that who makes a deinotherium in 1:30 scale don't have any technical problem to make a baluchitherium in the same scale. Sales is another question. Of course it doesn't sell as much as a T-rex but probably it sells as much as some sauropods. As baluchitherium is larger in many aspects and only a little heavier than a large deinotherium, I believe it is not as bulky as a deino. Anyway, I agree with you and I would love best a paraceratherium bulky like a rhino than the half giraffe/horse interepretation of CollectA. It was surely a very massive creature although it is also very tall and long.
I like best th pose of this diagram than the giraffe pose. Very Happy

I don't say it is a technical problem, making a big sauropod is possible so there is no technical reason MOJÖ would be unable to make a Paraceratherium. I was talking about commercial reasons. This animal is believed to reach 4,5 or even 5,5 meters at shoulders. It means a 1:30 Indricotherium would be 15 or 18 cm at shoulder. For example, the 2012 COLLECTA giraffe is 18cm at the TOP of the head !

I have a 1:40 Indricotherium model and it is already a massive guy Wink

Very nice comparisons, thanks for showing! I don't have so extreme data about the size of a baluchitherium, 4,5 m at shoulder is closer from what I can find. Anyway, I'm not as documented with prehistoric life as you are.
Also, there is always the option of the brand choose a smaller species inside the genus what is not an excelent idea when the animal being represented is the largest known land mammal. :)

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PostSubject: Re: A manufacturers view on scaling   Mon Dec 10, 2012 4:59 pm

Hi Everyone

This is a very nice discussion, its refreshing to hear the different thoughts and ideas pertaining to scale.

Balti's idea in respect to the Hasbro idea does have some merit and is worth considering however I am loathe to have models selling for US$100+, unless it was a 1:10 scale version of Crocobert, then we might make an exception Very Happy I think we might sell a few of those on STS!!! alien pirat
No seriously, the idea does make sense, thank you Balti, i am considering this.

Regarding the Baluchitherium, my view is that if we made this then it would have to be a 1:30 scale model, however as rightly pointed out by Kiki and Roger it would be very big. That said if the Prehistoric mammals prove popular then it would be such a shame if we didn't do a good representation of the largest known land mammal on both a size and quality level.
We cant keep everything to scale as i mentioned before but sometimes exceptions can be made.

Worse way it would make a very attractive door stop Laughing Laughing Laughing Just joking!

Many thanks everyone for your thoughts and ideas.

James
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PostSubject: Re: A manufacturers view on scaling   Mon Dec 10, 2012 5:44 pm

Roger wrote:
Very nice comparisons, thanks for showing! I don't have so extreme data about the size of a baluchitherium, 4,5 m at shoulder is closer from what I can find. Anyway, I'm not as documented with prehistoric life as you are.
Also, there is always the option of the brand choose a smaller species inside the genus what is not an excelent idea when the animal being represented is the largest known land mammal. :)

Even at 4,5m at shoulders, it is huge. About the size, I agree a smaller specie would not be the best idea for showing the largest known land mammal. It's the same with all these blue whales smaller than the humpback whales Laughing Laughing Laughing

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PostSubject: Re: A manufacturers view on scaling   Tue Dec 11, 2012 12:45 am

Egbert wrote:

Balti's idea in respect to the Hasbro idea does have some merit and is worth considering however I am loathe to have models selling for US$100+, unless it was a 1:10 scale version of Crocobert, then we might make an exception I think we might sell a few of those on STS!!!
James

Laughing pale Laughing
I'm sure the 1:10 Crocobert idea would be a colossal... flop! affraid
Also, the only extraterrestrial I know with almost the same proportions as me it is little Lionel Messi. I'm only slightly bulkier and of course much more talented playing football. Like a Star @ heaven Like a Star @ heaven Wink


Kikimalou wrote:

It's the same with all these blue whales smaller than the humpback whales

That's a great point to explain why it is hard to work with animals in scale.
How many vintage 1:32 scale brands made a blue whale?
Even a pygmy blue whale would be huge in that scales.
Anyway it is not understandeable seeing them smaller than a humpback whale, I agree! Very Happy

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PostSubject: Re: A manufacturers view on scaling   Tue Dec 11, 2012 5:22 am

Roger wrote:

Kikimalou wrote:

It's the same with all these blue whales smaller than the humpback whales

That's a great point to explain why it is hard to work with animals in scale.
How many vintage 1:32 scale brands made a blue whale?
Even a pygmy blue whale would be huge in that scales.
Anyway it is not understandeable seeing them smaller than a humpback whale, I agree! Very Happy

It is indeed the problem when the most interesting characteristic of an animal is the gigantism Laughing

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PostSubject: Re: A manufacturers view on scaling   Tue Dec 11, 2012 7:14 am

Kikimalou wrote:
Roger wrote:

Kikimalou wrote:

It's the same with all these blue whales smaller than the humpback whales

That's a great point to explain why it is hard to work with animals in scale.
How many vintage 1:32 scale brands made a blue whale?
Even a pygmy blue whale would be huge in that scales.
Anyway it is not understandeable seeing them smaller than a humpback whale, I agree! Very Happy

It is indeed the problem when the most interesting characteristic of an animal is the gigantism Laughing

Laughing Laughing

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PostSubject: Baltimore zoo   Tue Dec 11, 2012 9:39 am

Thanks for considering my idea, based upon the success of the Hasbro Star Wars line.
So I think a good compromise would be to have: Elephants(since the largest figure) the size of the Safari WW size and sell for that $20 range, and then have the rest of the "larger mammals" (Big cats, antelope, rhinos, hippos, giraffes, great apes, ostriches etc. sell for $15 - $6 range) be to "relative scale" to those elephants.
*That way if you did a savannah diorama at least you would have a "majority" of the animals look descent together.
Then for example do small mammals(Monkeys, meerkats, armadillos, otters, koalas etc.) be to a "larger scale" for safety regulations.

I think it's a good compromise.
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PostSubject: Re: A manufacturers view on scaling   Tue Dec 11, 2012 9:45 am

baltimore zoo wrote:
Thanks for considering my idea, based upon the success of the Hasbro Star Wars line.
So I think a good compromise would be to have: Elephants(since the largest figure) the size of the Safari WW size and sell for that $20 range, (...)

I would like to see Mojo elephants in scale as big as WW ones (1:20-1:18), I'm sure it would be lovely! Very Happy

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PostSubject: Re: A manufacturers view on scaling   Tue Dec 11, 2012 2:46 pm

Welcome James!

I found really interesting what you said about scales. It´s something I´ve been thinking about for a long time, and that was my conclussion so I´m happy I was correct at least in part. I can perfectly understand the reasons of each figurine size.

Thank you!

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PostSubject: Baltimore zoo   Wed Dec 12, 2012 9:13 am

Forgot to say, since you would loathe having to pay over $100(Like I said the most expensive figure would be in that affordable $25 range), but perhaps charging $50-$100 for a playset of some sort to display the animals. Like an Arctic set for the polars, or a Kopje for an African animals etc..
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PostSubject: A manufacturers view on scaling   Thu Dec 13, 2012 10:01 pm

I do have a question... First, I am glad the topic of scaling came up. I understand about not having the animal figures small so that children can choke on them, but.... how does a company that puts out "toobs" and "minis" get away with releasing small figures? If they can make minis and smaller animals for toobs... why can't the scale of animal figures be consistent? :}
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PostSubject: Baltimore zoo   Fri Dec 14, 2012 9:49 am

Great point Mark1 ! If they can make toob size animal figures, then they should be able to do an entire line of "relative scale".
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PostSubject: A manufacturers view on scaling   Sat Dec 15, 2012 12:17 am

Exactly! Thank you! Now..... which company will be brave enough to start such an enterprise...................???
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PostSubject: Re: A manufacturers view on scaling   Sat Dec 15, 2012 9:26 am

Mark1 wrote:
Exactly! Thank you! Now..... which company will be brave enough to start such an enterprise...................???

Noah`s Pals did, - but they were sold and shut down Sad

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PostSubject: A manufacturers view on scaling   Sat Dec 15, 2012 11:44 pm

That neat and sad at the same time... I checked my source that I usually buy from and they have Noah's Pals... all in 1:24 scale. Go to tgftoys.com
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PostSubject: Baltimore zoo   Tue Dec 18, 2012 8:49 am

Yes, Noah Pal's did to relative scale, but they weren't the best quality of figure line.
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